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	<title>Comments on: Gavaskar V Ponting (revisited)</title>
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	<description>India-India-India Jai-Jai-Jai (i3j3)</description>
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		<title>By: Sreesanth fined&#8230; &#171; i3j3Cricket :: A blog for fans of Indian cricket&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-5002</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sreesanth fined&#8230; &#171; i3j3Cricket :: A blog for fans of Indian cricket&#8230;]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Sep 2007 23:43:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[[...] I have said before on several occasions on this blogsite, I am not a fan of sledging. I do not believe sledging should [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I have said before on several occasions on this blogsite, I am not a fan of sledging. I do not believe sledging should [...]</p>
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		<title>By: News in brief: Tuesday 20 March 2007 &#171; i3j3Cricket :: A blog for fans of Indian cricket&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-386</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[News in brief: Tuesday 20 March 2007 &#171; i3j3Cricket :: A blog for fans of Indian cricket&#8230;]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-386</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] has apologized for his Hookes remark. We&#8217;ve previously discussed this topic at length.&#160;Here is a link to another [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] has apologized for his Hookes remark. We&#8217;ve previously discussed this topic at length.&nbsp;Here is a link to another [...]</p>
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		<title>By: sampath kumar</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-344</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sampath kumar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Mar 2007 10:38:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-344</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mohan,
I haven&#039;t seriously looked at different committees of ICC in detail--but I do know that gaveskar, Holding etc have positions of influence.  One referee in particular seems to be appointed for a particular country  more often and that country players do get lenience--he is often referred to as a Honorary citizen of that country!!!!!!  keep guessing!!!!
Sub continental countries do have more clout now than 10 or 15 years ago because of India&#039;s TV coverage and income from that part of that world.
It was a farce when Ranatunga stopped a game in Australia after his bowler was no balled--his Manager was talking on the mobile, on the field to Sri lankan authorities  re walk out etc--ICC should have then and there itself allowed the umpires to eject the official and ban him for life, if ranatunga refused to continue the game, then the Umpires would have and should have awarded the game to the opposition and ranatunga and Sri lanka penalised by ICC--it didn&#039;t happen and from therre on, ONLY MONEY HAS TALKED-- 
Re my brother D Hair--all umpires fololw and worship a special kind of brotherhood--no funny handshakes!!!!!  It is a tragedy he has been banned from umpiring in the World cup despite being in the top four  umpires for the past four years--  OF COURSE, HE MADE A WRONG CALL AT THE WRONG TIME RE SUING ICC FOR COMPENSATION --BUT ICC LEFT HIM HIGH AND DRY FOR ITS OWN BENEFITS OF T V  MONEY FROM THE SUB CONTINENT Umpire Doctrove who also officiated in THAT game is umpiring at the World cup--why?---the stadiums would be burnt or the hotels would be bombed or somehow the matches couldn&#039;t be held in the West Indies---Goonda rule chaltha hai!!!! or Apartheid in reserve with non-white majority now at ICC!!!!!!

sampath

 Sampath]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mohan,<br />
I haven&#8217;t seriously looked at different committees of ICC in detail&#8211;but I do know that gaveskar, Holding etc have positions of influence.  One referee in particular seems to be appointed for a particular country  more often and that country players do get lenience&#8211;he is often referred to as a Honorary citizen of that country!!!!!!  keep guessing!!!!<br />
Sub continental countries do have more clout now than 10 or 15 years ago because of India&#8217;s TV coverage and income from that part of that world.<br />
It was a farce when Ranatunga stopped a game in Australia after his bowler was no balled&#8211;his Manager was talking on the mobile, on the field to Sri lankan authorities  re walk out etc&#8211;ICC should have then and there itself allowed the umpires to eject the official and ban him for life, if ranatunga refused to continue the game, then the Umpires would have and should have awarded the game to the opposition and ranatunga and Sri lanka penalised by ICC&#8211;it didn&#8217;t happen and from therre on, ONLY MONEY HAS TALKED&#8211;<br />
Re my brother D Hair&#8211;all umpires fololw and worship a special kind of brotherhood&#8211;no funny handshakes!!!!!  It is a tragedy he has been banned from umpiring in the World cup despite being in the top four  umpires for the past four years&#8211;  OF COURSE, HE MADE A WRONG CALL AT THE WRONG TIME RE SUING ICC FOR COMPENSATION &#8211;BUT ICC LEFT HIM HIGH AND DRY FOR ITS OWN BENEFITS OF T V  MONEY FROM THE SUB CONTINENT Umpire Doctrove who also officiated in THAT game is umpiring at the World cup&#8211;why?&#8212;the stadiums would be burnt or the hotels would be bombed or somehow the matches couldn&#8217;t be held in the West Indies&#8212;Goonda rule chaltha hai!!!! or Apartheid in reserve with non-white majority now at ICC!!!!!!</p>
<p>sampath</p>
<p> Sampath</p>
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		<title>By: gnbmdr</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-342</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gnbmdr]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Mar 2007 03:52:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-342</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ICC will be soft on most issues; since ICC does not want to offend any member country. Any host side will also be soft, since the host wants to be gracious and also do not want the tourists to walk out.  

When Mike Denness suspended Sachin,   (for wrong/biased reasons)  technically SA should not have agreed to an un-official test with India. That set a precedent for other countries. 

I think Darrel Hair suspension was also to placate Pakistan.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ICC will be soft on most issues; since ICC does not want to offend any member country. Any host side will also be soft, since the host wants to be gracious and also do not want the tourists to walk out.  </p>
<p>When Mike Denness suspended Sachin,   (for wrong/biased reasons)  technically SA should not have agreed to an un-official test with India. That set a precedent for other countries. </p>
<p>I think Darrel Hair suspension was also to placate Pakistan.</p>
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		<title>By: mohankaus</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-341</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mohankaus]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Mar 2007 00:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-341</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sampath,

I do know of your excellent umpiring record at all levels and we are grateful that you take the time to make comments here. 

Your point is well made. 

Yes, the whole system should be seen as more than &quot;jobs for the boys&quot;. Currently it is. 

You talk of the &quot;Dravid V Slater catch incident&quot;. I think the &quot;McGrath V Sarawan&quot; incident did as much, if not more image-damage. The Referee then was Mike Proctor!

On the Pakistan V England issue... Sigh! Another debate for another day please... Your &quot;brother D Hair&quot;? C&#039;mon Sam. Don&#039;t stir please :-)

Question: Is Gavaskar (as Chair of the ICC Technical Committee) in charge of &quot;ICC Referee Panel Selection&quot;? I thought his role was more to do with the rules of the game -- &quot;disabled javelin throwers&quot;, etc. I am not sure his committee appoints the referees. Clarification on this would be useful.

-- Mohan]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sampath,</p>
<p>I do know of your excellent umpiring record at all levels and we are grateful that you take the time to make comments here. </p>
<p>Your point is well made. </p>
<p>Yes, the whole system should be seen as more than &#8220;jobs for the boys&#8221;. Currently it is. </p>
<p>You talk of the &#8220;Dravid V Slater catch incident&#8221;. I think the &#8220;McGrath V Sarawan&#8221; incident did as much, if not more image-damage. The Referee then was Mike Proctor!</p>
<p>On the Pakistan V England issue&#8230; Sigh! Another debate for another day please&#8230; Your &#8220;brother D Hair&#8221;? C&#8217;mon Sam. Don&#8217;t stir please <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Question: Is Gavaskar (as Chair of the ICC Technical Committee) in charge of &#8220;ICC Referee Panel Selection&#8221;? I thought his role was more to do with the rules of the game &#8212; &#8220;disabled javelin throwers&#8221;, etc. I am not sure his committee appoints the referees. Clarification on this would be useful.</p>
<p>&#8211; Mohan</p>
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		<title>By: sampath kumar</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-338</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sampath kumar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:38:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-338</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[( as an umpire with 12 years experience , albeit in local/park cricket, I feel justified in giving the following opinion)
The fundamental problem with on field sledging/bad behaviour is that the umpires&#039; role have been severely diminished by committees involving and / chaired by retired players like Gavaskar, Holding, Border et al. All the match referees are EX Players--NOT ONE RETIRED UMPIRE--do you think ex players will penalise curreent players of another country --knowing well that other referees will protect players  from his own country next time around

In Chennai, Venkat and WI Umpire should have reported M Slater over Dravid catch incident--they didn&#039;t--then ICC had to force the umpires to report a few days after the incident due to pressure from armchair experts from all over the world!!! Why?--because the Umpires are getting castrated by committees made up of ex-players
Just to protect  a disabled javelin thrower, bowling arm degrees were incresed--none visible to the umpires&#039; eys on the field----Law 42 on over head high bouncers  is not followed in international matches as countries do not their fast bowlers to be taken out of attack for the rest of the innings after 3 such bouncers--again retired players like gavaskar et al chair or members of the committee --these balls are called wides and a bowler can bowl as many as he wants
Now, the awarding of matches when a team refuses to continue--has been taken away from umpires and given to match referees after the Pak--England match--where I back my brother d Hair 1000 per cent--who are the referees--EX PLAYERS APPOINTED BY GAVASKAR ET AL

If Gavaskar wants to continue to comment like what he has done, it is time he resigned as Chairman of/ member  ICC committees and then go full bore on all 6 cylinders!!!!

sampath]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>( as an umpire with 12 years experience , albeit in local/park cricket, I feel justified in giving the following opinion)<br />
The fundamental problem with on field sledging/bad behaviour is that the umpires&#8217; role have been severely diminished by committees involving and / chaired by retired players like Gavaskar, Holding, Border et al. All the match referees are EX Players&#8211;NOT ONE RETIRED UMPIRE&#8211;do you think ex players will penalise curreent players of another country &#8211;knowing well that other referees will protect players  from his own country next time around</p>
<p>In Chennai, Venkat and WI Umpire should have reported M Slater over Dravid catch incident&#8211;they didn&#8217;t&#8211;then ICC had to force the umpires to report a few days after the incident due to pressure from armchair experts from all over the world!!! Why?&#8211;because the Umpires are getting castrated by committees made up of ex-players<br />
Just to protect  a disabled javelin thrower, bowling arm degrees were incresed&#8211;none visible to the umpires&#8217; eys on the field&#8212;-Law 42 on over head high bouncers  is not followed in international matches as countries do not their fast bowlers to be taken out of attack for the rest of the innings after 3 such bouncers&#8211;again retired players like gavaskar et al chair or members of the committee &#8211;these balls are called wides and a bowler can bowl as many as he wants<br />
Now, the awarding of matches when a team refuses to continue&#8211;has been taken away from umpires and given to match referees after the Pak&#8211;England match&#8211;where I back my brother d Hair 1000 per cent&#8211;who are the referees&#8211;EX PLAYERS APPOINTED BY GAVASKAR ET AL</p>
<p>If Gavaskar wants to continue to comment like what he has done, it is time he resigned as Chairman of/ member  ICC committees and then go full bore on all 6 cylinders!!!!</p>
<p>sampath</p>
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		<title>By: Sudha</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-332</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sudha]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Mar 2007 13:11:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-332</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Gavaskar once got issues with West Indies as well and he\&#039;s now praising them.

http://www.cricinfo.com/link_to_database/ARCHIVE/2001-02/IND_IN_WI/NOSTALGIA/30APR2002.html

 To speak like that then and now is not only hypocritical and I am ashamed to know that he represents India in one way or other.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gavaskar once got issues with West Indies as well and he\&#8217;s now praising them.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.cricinfo.com/link_to_database/ARCHIVE/2001-02/IND_IN_WI/NOSTALGIA/30APR2002.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.cricinfo.com/link_to_database/ARCHIVE/2001-02/IND_IN_WI/NOSTALGIA/30APR2002.html</a></p>
<p> To speak like that then and now is not only hypocritical and I am ashamed to know that he represents India in one way or other.</p>
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		<title>By: Naveen</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-331</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Naveen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Mar 2007 12:52:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-331</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I find it funny that Gavaskar makes these comments when BCCI employed an Australian as Indian coach.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find it funny that Gavaskar makes these comments when BCCI employed an Australian as Indian coach.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Scribbler</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-329</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scribbler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Mar 2007 10:37:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-329</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And now McGrath jumps in to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=497&amp;objectid=10429158&amp;ref=rss&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;fuel the fire&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And now McGrath jumps in to <a href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=497&amp;objectid=10429158&amp;ref=rss" rel="nofollow">fuel the fire</a>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: blogesh</title>
		<link>http://i3j3cricket.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-328</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[blogesh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Mar 2007 10:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://i3j3cricket.wordpress.com/2007/03/16/gavaskar-v-ponting-revisited/#comment-328</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It would be interesting to define what constitutes sledging and what doesn’t? It is never always black and white. Consider the following scenarios - 


	- Wicket Keeper shouting encouragement to the bowler
 	- ‘Keeper asking the batsman to try and hit the ball for a six
	- ‘Keeper making jokes about the batsman to the slip fielder so that the batsman can hear it
	- ‘Keeper telling the batsman that he couldn’t even play club cricket in his country
	- ‘Keeper making a remark about the batsman’s girlfriend
	- ‘Keeper commenting on the colour of the batsman’s skin


It kind of starts moving from white to black with several (dark) shades of gray in between. Depending on your cultural background, some of it can be tolerated and some can’t. Some comments, no matter where you come from, are just plain wrong. But, how can you control what gets said out there in the field? The stump mikes can’t catch everything – neither can the umpires. It is very hard to monitor and control. Sadly, sledging is here to stay and we may as well get used to it.

The age old Aussie adage of “Whatever happens in the field stays in the field” also no longer applies. Sledging continues off the field, with players making comments about the opposition as soon as the visiting team arrives. The thing is that, although the Aussies are frequently accused of sledging, other countries aren’t far behind. As you’ve mentioned, Mohan - Sreesanth is a very good example of an Indian cricketer who would rank very high on the “World’s top sledgers” list. If sledging is bad, what is worse is the intensity with which younger players (world over) are picking it up. All this is really not good for cricket. It probably used to be a gentleman’s game, but it no longer is.

Getting back to the topic, I agree with your observations. 

Gavaskar &lt;b&gt;may&lt;/b&gt; be completely wrong about his assessment of the Aussies, but he certainly has the right to criticise them and voice his opinion. Ponting  is spot on about the Indian cricket team not having won too many matches, but he was wrong in quoting it out of context as a reply to Gavaskar’s comments and turning it into a personal attack on Sunny. Similarly, Gavaskar may be right in saying that the kind of language used in the field will not be tolerated in a pub, but it was wrong to bring up Hooksey. 

One thing I would like to add is that Aussies generally don’t consider themselves to be arrogant. They think that the confidence and swagger that they carry with them is probably mistaken for arrogance. This may actually be true, but incidents such as the way they bundled out the chief guest at the Champions trophy haven’t helped this image. I have to add that sledging has been one of the biggest contributors to this image.

I would like to mention something that happened during the Sydney Olympics. &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.truthinmedia.org/TruthinMedia/Bulletins2000/tim2000-10-1.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;American athletes were considered arrogant and boorish&lt;/a&gt;. They were even booed and jeered in some venues. If the Aussie public back then thought the American athletes as arrogant, the majority of cricket supporters across the world now hold the same image of the Aussie cricketer. If they want to change this image, a small start would be to stop sledging. And maybe the rest of the world will follow suit…

Meanwhile, let us get on with it and enjoy the World cup.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would be interesting to define what constitutes sledging and what doesn’t? It is never always black and white. Consider the following scenarios &#8211; </p>
<p>	- Wicket Keeper shouting encouragement to the bowler<br />
 	- ‘Keeper asking the batsman to try and hit the ball for a six<br />
	- ‘Keeper making jokes about the batsman to the slip fielder so that the batsman can hear it<br />
	- ‘Keeper telling the batsman that he couldn’t even play club cricket in his country<br />
	- ‘Keeper making a remark about the batsman’s girlfriend<br />
	- ‘Keeper commenting on the colour of the batsman’s skin</p>
<p>It kind of starts moving from white to black with several (dark) shades of gray in between. Depending on your cultural background, some of it can be tolerated and some can’t. Some comments, no matter where you come from, are just plain wrong. But, how can you control what gets said out there in the field? The stump mikes can’t catch everything – neither can the umpires. It is very hard to monitor and control. Sadly, sledging is here to stay and we may as well get used to it.</p>
<p>The age old Aussie adage of “Whatever happens in the field stays in the field” also no longer applies. Sledging continues off the field, with players making comments about the opposition as soon as the visiting team arrives. The thing is that, although the Aussies are frequently accused of sledging, other countries aren’t far behind. As you’ve mentioned, Mohan &#8211; Sreesanth is a very good example of an Indian cricketer who would rank very high on the “World’s top sledgers” list. If sledging is bad, what is worse is the intensity with which younger players (world over) are picking it up. All this is really not good for cricket. It probably used to be a gentleman’s game, but it no longer is.</p>
<p>Getting back to the topic, I agree with your observations. </p>
<p>Gavaskar <b>may</b> be completely wrong about his assessment of the Aussies, but he certainly has the right to criticise them and voice his opinion. Ponting  is spot on about the Indian cricket team not having won too many matches, but he was wrong in quoting it out of context as a reply to Gavaskar’s comments and turning it into a personal attack on Sunny. Similarly, Gavaskar may be right in saying that the kind of language used in the field will not be tolerated in a pub, but it was wrong to bring up Hooksey. </p>
<p>One thing I would like to add is that Aussies generally don’t consider themselves to be arrogant. They think that the confidence and swagger that they carry with them is probably mistaken for arrogance. This may actually be true, but incidents such as the way they bundled out the chief guest at the Champions trophy haven’t helped this image. I have to add that sledging has been one of the biggest contributors to this image.</p>
<p>I would like to mention something that happened during the Sydney Olympics. <a href="http://www.truthinmedia.org/TruthinMedia/Bulletins2000/tim2000-10-1.html" rel="nofollow">American athletes were considered arrogant and boorish</a>. They were even booed and jeered in some venues. If the Aussie public back then thought the American athletes as arrogant, the majority of cricket supporters across the world now hold the same image of the Aussie cricketer. If they want to change this image, a small start would be to stop sledging. And maybe the rest of the world will follow suit…</p>
<p>Meanwhile, let us get on with it and enjoy the World cup.</p>
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